GR86 Engine Failure

[Conscript]

I think that PVGR, volksdub and Conscript all make a valid point and that there is a need for us (me definitely included!) to keep a sense of proportion here. However, the more the engine failure issue gains coverage on the Internet - either through the leading consumer-facing automotive titles and/or via social media - the greater the risk of reputational damage to Toyota Motor Corporation, Toyota (GB) PLC and, specifically, the GR86. Any such reputational damage might well have an adverse affect on the residual values of GR86s - in short, those of us who were hoping that any depreciation on the GR86 would be pretty minimal might have to think again...

True, although personally I'm not really bothered about that. I ordered the car with the intention of long term ownership and enjoyment. So to be honest, I'd actually welcome more coverage and exposure so that Toyota is forced to acknowledge the issue publicly, and offer either a recall or TSB.

I'm not overly concerned about the problem, but a bit of official recognition would mean Toyota would have no leg to stand on if my car went pop.

 

[AndyRC]

I think that PVGR, volksdub and Conscript all make a valid point and that there is a need for us (me definitely included!) to keep a sense of proportion here. However, the more the engine failure issue gains coverage on the Internet - either through the leading consumer-facing automotive titles and/or via social media - the greater the risk of reputational damage to Toyota Motor Corporation, Toyota (GB) PLC and, specifically, the GR86. Any such reputational damage might well have an adverse affect on the residual values of GR86s - in short, those of us who were hoping that any depreciation on the GR86 would be pretty minimal might have to think again...

I don’t think depreciation will be an issue with a Toyota GR86, highly desirable, largely unavailable, IF, the car is not modified, has full Toyota Service history , and a MyT history from day 1 to prove it’s never been tracked , a full Toyota service history and 10 year warranty is worth a lot .

When I had a Golf R (mappers favourite) and AMG C63 I always asked that at every service they checked software and exhaust and confirm on the service report they were standard and the car was “unmolested”.

The one thing I couldn’t easily prove was the car had not been “tracked”, a question I was often asked when selling privately. The MyT allows me to do that and will be active from day 1. So basically you can buy with peace of mind and “assurance” from @AndyRC , if I decide to sell assuming I ever get mine

 

[Grblue86]

I am now seriously considering cancelling. I bought the car with the intention to use it in a couple of track days a year and for weekend fun but if can't do the former then I might as well buy a Caterham. And to rub salt on the wound I do think depreciation will be an issue,

 

[KobayashiMaru86]

Cars always lose money eventually. You only make a loss if you sell, which I don't intend to. But those first 3 years will be key in me saying it's keeper or not.

This is feeling like Mk2 Fabia vRS again though which will be ironic that the 2 cars I've bought new have engine issues the internet is all over.

 

[AndyRC]

Cars always lose money eventually. You only make a loss if you sell, which I don't intend to. But those first 3 years will be key in me saying it's keeper or not.

This is feeling like Mk2 Fabia vRS again though which will be ironic that the 2 cars I've bought new have engine issues the internet is all over.

There have been plenty of engine issues and will continue to be , remember the Ford Eco Boost engines which failed due to a bit of plastic tubing breaking in the cooling system ? AMG 6.2 L head bolts failing etc. Its more a case of how the manufacturer deals with it than the issue itself , and we have a 10 year warranty, virtually unheard of. I doubt we will hear anything until Toyota are 100% clear what the issue is

 

[KobayashiMaru86]

There have been plenty of engine issues and will continue to be , remember the Ford Eco Boost engines which failed due to a bit of plastic tubing breaking in the cooling system ? AMG 6.2 L head bolts failing etc. Its more a case of how the manufacturer deals with it than the issue itself , and we have a 10 year warranty, virtually unheard of. I doubt we will hear anything until Toyota are 100% clear what the issue is

As I've said before that I think once Toyota know what the score is, they will recall and sort it. They did for valve springs and other things on the last one. But it does need sorting or it will become known for it. Not necessarily an issue since it's a car for enthusiasts so as long as the corrective action has been taken if needed then it's fine.

 

[AndyRC]

As I've said before that I think once Toyota know what the score is, they will recall and sort it. They did for valve springs and other things on the last one. But it does need sorting or it will become known for it. Not necessarily an issue since it's a car for enthusiasts so as long as the corrective action has been taken if needed then it's fine.

Agree, the tinterweb and “so shall media“ are good at spreading news virally whilst big corporations will say nothing until they are very clear A. There is an actually an issue, B. The Root Cause and C. What the fix is . If the US a dealership had not denied the claim and everyone heard about it, I doubt we would be seeing the level of interest/concern.

UK a customers are also likely to be best part of a year into the build program, if not 2/3 so any production teething problems will hopefully be ironed out by the time our cars arrive.

 

[CTG 300]

I agree with most of the responses to my original post at #180 above - for my part, though, the manner in which Toyota (GB) PLC (TGB) handles the engine failure issue will be an important factor in any decision to keep the car for the long term (as was my original intention)...

Meanwhile, I intend to adopt a step-by-step approach and keep a close watching brief on TGB's communications pending a Test Drive.

 

[KobayashiMaru86]

I'm tempted not to test drive if I get chance so it's totally new to me. Debated having a go of my brother's 86 again but he said no, best not to. I'll remember that when mine turns up

 

[GR86GRY]

Next Youtuber up getting involved with obligatory click bait face "OH NO! I just did a squat and shat out this RTV"



His latest video doesn't say much but apparently the FT Speed channel will have his own findings shortly.

 

[GR86GRY]

Well it's up, and doesn't look good but less to do with RTV Skip to about 5 mins 30 to see in the pan

 

[KobayashiMaru86]

Funny how it's often the Americans who money shift...

 

[garybee]

Doesn't look like the typical damage that I'd expect to see from a missed gear/over-rev. I'd expect to see catastrophic failure of a 'rod or big end cap/bolt or similar (effectively one of the components that sees greater load through inertia). That looks more like what I would expect to see from an engine failure due to low oil pressure.

Before anyone starts nit picking, I'm not saying that bearing 'pick up' can't happen through over-revving the engine. We all know that oil film strength has to carry these loads too.

 

[AndyRC]

Funny how it's often the Americans who money shift...

Funny how he says “someone MAY have money shifted” , he knows they did Now AFAIK the auto box won’t let you change down until It’s happy that it’s safe to do so

 

[AndyRC]

Doesn't look like the typical damage that I'd expect to see from a missed gear/over-rev. I'd expect to see catastrophic failure of a 'rod or big end cap/bolt or similar (effectively one of the components that sees greater load through inertia). That looks more like what I would expect to see from an engine failure due to low oil pressure.

Before anyone starts nit picking, I'm not saying that bearing 'pick up' can't happen through over-revving the engine. We all know that oil film strength has to carry these loads too.

As most if not all of the failures appear to be track related could it be that the oil is getting carried away from the pick up causing starvation and what is really required is a baffled sump, there was very little RTV in that pick up tube but a LOT of metal

 

[ZN8]

Funny how it's often the Americans who money shift...

I was thinking that. I can't believe how many times I've read this happening. The gates aren't that close together that it should happen this often.

 

[KobayashiMaru86]

I was thinking that. I can't believe how many times I've read this happening. The gates are that close together that it should happen this often.

The gates are close on the old 86 and I never had this issue. I don't think I've ever done it by accident in any car.

 

[GR86GRY]

The gates are close on the old 86 and I never had this issue. I don't think I've ever done it by accident in any car.

Me either. I actually had to Google what it was

 

[KobayashiMaru86]

As most if not all of the failures appear to be track related could it be that the oil is getting carried away from the pick up causing starvation and what is really required is a baffled sump, there was very little RTV in that pick up tube but a LOT of metal

We won't know if they didn't have enough oil in it, was it ragged from cold, drifted for far too long. But baffled sump is on my shopping list once warranty is up and I start tracking. Oil starvation could be an issue anyway.

 

[AndyRC]

We won't know if they didn't have enough oil in it, was it ragged from cold, drifted for far too long. But baffled sump is on my shopping list once warranty is up and I start tracking. Oil starvation could be an issue anyway.

The annoying thing is it would cost all to include a baffle plate in the sump if it was included in the oem design Afaik Subaru off an STi one in their parts list

Simple physics tells you that oil is going to move away from the pick up tube under hard cornering, acceleration/ deceleration