Electric Cars

As soon as the tax breaks are gone, and VED on EVs is higher than running an old banger, you can expect to see the residuals drop even harder. I don’t know why people seem to ignore residuals when calculating the cost of running a car. If you’re losing £12k a year then that’s a grand a month you could be spending on high octane race fuel and bespoke maintenance for any classic sports car with zero depreciation.

If you want to save the planet then get on your bike, or use public transport. It doesn’t always pay to be an early adopter.
 
I can’t subscribe to “electric cars are green” - weight alone makes them unacceptable. Hydrogen will win.

The only reason to go electric is the company tax savings;

Tesla Model 3 from £172 per year,
BMW 320 from £2,672,
Toyota GR86 from £2,285

If you are running a company car it’s crazy not to run a Tesla. For everyone else or second hand, they make no sense..

The electric car drivers I admire are the owners who run their BMW i3, Honda-e, etc as primary but second cars.
 
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I genuinely hope that it's not allowed to be sold in the UK, it's just to big/heavy. Even NCAP (Autocar yesterday) alluded to the fact that all their insistence of more and more safety measures have made cars bigger and heavier, not good for the planet and not good for head on crashes. I feel nauseous at the thought of being hit head on by a huge SUV most likely by a distracted driver trying to navigate a sub menu on the touchscreen while driving. Being hit by a cybertruck the thing would just drive up and over a GR86 and flatten it in the process, I am sure the safety cell of our cars will easily withstand its own weight on its roof but not three tonnes of cybertruck!
 
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For 5,4m long and bullet resistent bodywork, it is suprisingly light for what it is...

Governments made a mistake completely abandoning road tax based on weight, it should have remained in the balance....
 
The absolute carnage of residual values of EV’s continues at pace. I’ve been monitoring the market for the last few months. My Tesla Model Y, in the spec I’ve got it in, is the ‘least’ depreciating EV on the market yet it has lost £23k in value in just over a year.

Insurance quotes have doubled in that time. I’ve gone from paying £800 in the first year, £950 on renewal in September and change of address, latest quotes are a minimum of £1800. There have been no changes in my circumstances etc.

And the queues for the public charging get longer…

And the cost of charging hasn’t come down by very much….

After ten years of driving EV’s to say that I’m disillusioned with them is an understatement!
I think us non believe EV people have been predicting that EV's are not the answer. I sympathise with your situation but EV's cannot be phased in in the tight time frames being suggested.
 
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To be honest, I still think EV is the answer, certain for most users, it's just whilst the tech has improved it's not improved to such a degree I consider it to be for me yet. I did the same thing with mobile phones, when they started to switch to smart phones... most early smart phones were fricken awful.

I think they are great around towns, and shorter journeys, especially if you're not doing a lot of mileage... but they are quite expensive, and the depreciation on them is pretty grim. If I remember right too, lot of them are leased and not retained? Sure I read that somewhere. I'm sure Onehp will fact check me on that ;D
 
For 5,4m long and bullet resistent bodywork, it is suprisingly light for what it is...

Governments made a mistake completely abandoning road tax based on weight, it should have remained in the balance....
This is the logic. (y) Tax on weight is “the” answer. “Lightness” should be the goal.
 
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Two pics from today within a minute of each other, have a guess which range is the one with the heater on, heat or range in winter sucks
 

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I have worked with technology for most of my life and think it can be too soon to buy a new product. With cars I always bought the end of run model when it was proven which is why I will not mod my GRY until any problems have shown up - but we should now be close to that.
At 61 I doubt I will get an EV as I do believe hydrogen will come in soon. Bradford council have just announced licences to build two new hydrogen filling stations as the demand will rise. JCB have developed their new commercial hydrogen engine. Toyota have developed a direct injection hydrogen engine. They have also worked with a chinese company and solved the ignition problem that stopped amonia injection system on ICE cars. Others will now follow quickly. As far as EV xars I would let the initial owner take the massive hit in depreciation and buy a 2 year old car. The problem is you are always buying out of date technology as it is changing so fast.
 
Hyundai i30N.webp


Swapped the Tesla for a Hyundai i30 N Performance with the DCT - which should make longer journeys a bit more comfortable. £300 insurance against the £2k+ quoted for the Tesla soothes my pain.

Depreciation aside, it's well documented above my list of grievances of running an EV, but this is the first time in over ten years that I haven't got something to plug in when I come home. Will I miss them? Sure for the convenience, silence, acceleration and connectivity. But for everything else they've become too awkward and expensive to use, own, insure and maintain. My electric journeys are over for the forseeable, there's nothing on the market that really interests me (Cybertruck aside?!) but until there are some major overhauls with the network, insurance is brought down to a reasonable level and someone actually works out what the frig we're going to do with all these depleting batteries then they're not for me.
 
Congrats, very nice motor . I have always liked the look and sound of the I30 N and I20 N, especially in petrol blue. But not had the chance to drive either. What are your thoughts so far? I guess 4doors and DCT is the point of differentiation compared to the GR?
 
Congrats, very nice motor . I have always liked the look and sound of the I30 N and I20 N, especially in petrol blue. But not had the chance to drive either. What are your thoughts so far? I guess 4doors and DCT is the point of differentiation compared to the GR?
Yes that’s exactly it; a little more practicality. I gave it a push this afternoon over the Mountain, there is quite a bit of torque steer and the front tyres are easily overwhelmed under hard braking. Wheel spin in third gear is doable…maybe some of that is the cold weather and the awful P Zero’s it’s equipped with - never been a fan (I will switch to F1 SS asap) but it’s what I expected from a FWD car with 275bhp, and that’s a good thing. I like the amount of kit on it too. I’m not going to mod it anywhere near as much as my GRY has (and will have!) but it could do with a little tweak here and there…
 
A changeover in autocar technology is one of the biggest in the world of personal goods, propbably bigger then horse to car. Any such switch comes with uncertainties and doesn't work well when there is a lot of money involved and even the future of complete industries. And in this modern age it becomes even harder when information spreads so quickly and one is bombarded by news on solid state batteries, hydrogen tech (which I doubt quite much) and now ammonia (which actually has potential but also deep downfalls if not done properly), spreading doubt on the right way forward.

From reading here I learn that the UK has ambitious goals for BEV but hasn't come very far yet. So I understand the scepticism. Goalposts will be moved if nothing dramatic happens soon.
Here it is bit the same, all car sales are down incl BEV. Inflation and price cuts makes that people are more waiting to see what happens. But at the same time already half my street is BEV, charging at home is dead cheap here and tax and insurance are low. Majority of completely average people not into cars that I talk to, will consider only hybrids or EV car for their next new car purchase despite there being no tax cuts in place anymore - adoption rates differ though and still 47% of Swedes live in apartments so there adoption is slower. This whole process will take long time and it will be 20-30 years before 99% is no longer ICE and BEV and/or whatever better again takes over.

It's hard to do buy right in general. EVs are expensive yet (but not as expensive as some think, equivalent size and comfort car (not even performance) isn't that much cheaper (without tax cuts)) but still there is a genuine worry that once a cheaper solid state battery car comes the old tech will be as much worth as a 4 year old mobile phone. At the same time, at some point in time not too dissimilar, when EV will genuinely will be cheaper everywhere than a fossil car and the general public realises this, the latter will also lose near enough all value unless they are proper special. Most taxis are BEV here so that is telling that story already in that segment here.

So my advice is, if anyone askes me here, get a car you really like so you can be happy with it for a long time if you have to. At least from my perspective, ICE or EV will roughly, very roughly, cost about the same, the former in higher running cost and the latter due to depreciation from a higher level.

And for me that means BEV because for at least a family/travel car, the EV is a much more pleasant proposition and charging cheap at home is extremely convenient. We did ski trips and a euro trip last summer and it was perfectly fine too. But I appreciate it can be different in the UK or other countries (work to do) and in personal preference. And I am betting both horses as I very much enjoy both my GRY (with a hope it falls in the special category in 10-20 years) and our family BEV which I find very pleasant to drive as a roomy comfy car. I enjoy them for myself and for my family, not for some unknown next owner...

Brain fart over.
 
wow that is...................just bloody awful!

not being nasty but were they blind that designed that front grill with that great big flat square in the middle :eek:
not to mention the huge 'engine' cover. Not a huge Beemer fan even though they do occasionally make good cars (few friends drive their Hybrid X5's) but not everything seems to be well planned.