Hyundai Ioniq 5 N

Old Boy said:
I think its REALLY sad that folk are having to fool themselves into thinking their EV has a DCT gearbox, an engine and makes engine noises ! Its like vegetarians who miss meat so much they still have to have veggie food shaped and made to taste like MEAT !! veggie sausages, burgers, chicken nuggets, fish fingers etc. Bit sad really. That hyundri thing still weighs 2000 kilos so with 650hp its really a car with 325 bhp per tonne. No 2 tonne car will ever corner like a one tonne car., its going to eat tyres if you drive it like that, "best handling car" " more nimble" ?? people have very short memories of how fun cars used to be, light and nimble like P205GTi etc etc !! If an EV is so fantastic, why try to make it feel like you are in an apparently 'old tech' engined normal car? I mean when they made jet engines for aircraft they didn't try to make them sound like propeller engines !!
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To be fair, I was sceptic too. Many petrolheads were untill they tried it. And no, the sound will never be the main feature. The irony is that all the GR car owners have fake sounds in the cabin too, and I actually switched off the fake sounds in my last three (!) ICE cars because I thought they sounded shait...

The N team executed it so well that on a good drive, you truly forget you're in an EV.

As for making analogies, the food comparo has been done to death and is somewhat lacking. I have another two, being a carosopher and yes, this is actually big...

Driving *properly* gives great joy, as we know accompanied with the music of an engine. Well there is another such activity that is emotional and is accompanied by sound. Aka dancing.

- Majority of EV's are like dancing to the sound of the wind blowing outside. Zzz
- Some EV's, with some sounds, are like dancing to a pretty bad record stuck on repeat. Annoying
- Modern ICE cars are like dancing to a live concert, but with the artist enhanced through speakers and the odd lip sync...
- Hero ICE cars are like dancing to a live acoustic band standing 2m meters away
- And the 5N is like dancing to a great DJ mixing records - if fact the driver is the DJ really as you compose as you choose gears... Not the same as the one before but you sure can still dance your heart out!

Above assuming you have the joy in life and the basic bodily mobility to understand the emotional depth of the dance reference.

Another analogy, with the car as an instument. Opposition to the 5 N (on paper) is like opposition to the first electrical guitar or the first sythesiser.

Yet nowadays hundreds of millions listen to 100% electronic music, streamed digitally and listened to on electrically driven speakers. Totally normal...
 
And lastly
Old Boy said:
No 2 tonne car will ever corner like a one tonne car., its going to eat tyres if you drive it like that, "best handling car" " more nimble" ?? people have very short memories of how fun cars used to be, light and nimble like P205GTi etc etc !!
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I need to correct you, it's 2,2 tonne, that's 10% more.

I've been the biggest weight purist and I had already dismissed this car for this very reason. No way in h'ell can this thing be fun on my preferred playground, narrow, very twisty, bumpy forest roads. I was wrong. This car handles and is fun. Is a 1 tonne car more fun? Sure is (if the handling is good). But this one is fun too and it really shrinks around you as you push on, I forget the weight, it just feels like a fun hot hatch. Not just me, I could reference plenty of reviews done by proper drivers that have known to pedal some of the most interesting cars on this planet. Also the last one I posted here just before, in the wet, Drift King and NOB, praise it as the big suprise in the wet, commenting it feels agile and light in the corners. It's possible to understand to some degree because the weight distribution is 50/50 and the centre of gravity is lower then your average ICE hot hatch (referenced by Hyundai as being lower than the cg of the i30N).

Then there is the mere pricipal resistance to EV. Repeat after me: "They are too heavy!". Some are. But this one belies it's size, it's actually the interior size of a Cayenne coupe and larger in the rear seat then a Model Y. And it weighs very similar to the smaller Panamera Turbo S and the RS6/7, pure ICE cars. And it's 200kg lighter than the new M5 touring. So for the size and performance, it's actually not very heavy.

But if you don't need or have good use of the size and the cost is a bit much, I'm pretty sure the near future will bring smaller fun EV's, hopefully many....

Thanks for bringing up all the classic objections, so that I may adress them. I had to do the same to myself...
 
Duke said:
Is anyone forcing you to buy one?
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yes, actually, we are all being 'conditioned' and forced to accept EV's now folk are lying to themselves and trying to kid themselves theyre great by making them sound like ICE cars , even having fake sounding 'gearchanges' ... its SAD. The geeks and eco wallys have us under their thumbs along with the woke eco net zero dumb governments..
 
Onehp said:
To be fair, I was sceptic too. Many petrolheads were untill they tried it. And no, the sound will never be the main feature. The irony is that all the GR car owners have fake sounds in the cabin too, and I actually switched off the fake sounds in my last three (!) ICE cars because I thought they sounded shait...

The N team executed it so well that on a good drive, you truly forget you're in an EV.

As for making analogies, the food comparo has been done to death and is somewhat lacking. I have another two, being a carosopher and yes, this is actually big...

Driving *properly* gives great joy, as we know accompanied with the music of an engine. Well there is another such activity that is emotional and is accompanied by sound. Aka dancing.

- Majority of EV's are like dancing to the sound of the wind blowing outside. Zzz
- Some EV's, with some sounds, are like dancing to a pretty bad record stuck on repeat. Annoying
- Modern ICE cars are like dancing to a live concert, but with the artist enhanced through speakers and the odd lip sync...
- Hero ICE cars are like dancing to a live acoustic band standing 2m meters away
- And the 5N is like dancing to a great DJ mixing records - if fact the driver is the DJ really as you compose as you choose gears... Not the same as the one before but you sure can still dance your heart out!

Above assuming you have the joy in life and the basic bodily mobility to understand the emotional depth of the dance reference.

Another analogy, with the car as an instument. Opposition to the 5 N (on paper) is like opposition to the first electrical guitar or the first sythesiser.

Yet nowadays hundreds of millions listen to 100% electronic music, streamed digitally and listened to on electrically driven speakers. Totally normal...
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and yet so many folk prefer the sound of vinyl to digital..
 
Old Boy said:
and yet so many folk prefer the sound of vinyl to digital..
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Yeah sure. Some people will keep a car just for how it sounds, and that's fine and obviously no EV will ever replace that.

For me, the car is a tool for driving, and the noises it makes are very important as a visceral and emotional feedback tool. But the sound isn't a thing by itself.
 
Onehp said:
To be fair, I was sceptic too. Many petrolheads were untill they tried it. And no, the sound will never be the main feature. The irony is that all the GR car owners have fake sounds in the cabin too, and I actually switched off the fake sounds in my last three (!) ICE cars because I thought they sounded shait...

The N team executed it so well that on a good drive, you truly forget you're in an EV.

As for making analogies, the food comparo has been done to death and is somewhat lacking. I have another two, being a carosopher and yes, this is actually big...

Driving *properly* gives great joy, as we know accompanied with the music of an engine. Well there is another such activity that is emotional and is accompanied by sound. Aka dancing.

- Majority of EV's are like dancing to the sound of the wind blowing outside. Zzz
- Some EV's, with some sounds, are like dancing to a pretty bad record stuck on repeat. Annoying
- Modern ICE cars are like dancing to a live concert, but with the artist enhanced through speakers and the odd lip sync...
- Hero ICE cars are like dancing to a live acoustic band standing 2m meters away
- And the 5N is like dancing to a great DJ mixing records - if fact the driver is the DJ really as you compose as you choose gears... Not the same as the one before but you sure can still dance your heart out!

Above assuming you have the joy in life and the basic bodily mobility to understand the emotional depth of the dance reference.

Another analogy, with the car as an instument. Opposition to the 5 N (on paper) is like opposition to the first electrical guitar or the first sythesiser.

Yet nowadays hundreds of millions listen to 100% electronic music, streamed digitally and listened to on electrically driven speakers. Totally normal...
Click to expand...
"The N team executed it so well that on a good drive, you truly forget you're in an EV."

If you love an ev so much, why would you want to 'forget' you are in one? I dont drive the GR and "forget Im in an ICE'd car" !! its always making excuses and trying to self-bluff yourself that a poxy electric motor is the 'car you always promised yourself' !! These things are FAKES !! trying to be ICE cars !
 
When you’re driving fast in an ICE car you’re listening for the engine note, trying to gauge some mechanical sympathy with the gearbox, little hints that you’re exceeding the grip of the tyres as they squeal through a corner. You are comparing this to your gyro in your inner ear, what you feel through the seat, your hands on the wheel and what you’re seeing.

With an EV those senses are either dulled or blanked out completely. There isn’t one area where an EV gives you more feedback than an ICE car, and for that reason that is why they currently don’t excite me or a lot of other people. Perhaps the only area where they remain impressive is under acceleration. But largely speaking, brake feel and the sensation of the steering, the pitch and roll of the car leave a lot to be desired.

An EV can try and match the sensation of driving an ICE, but there has never been one that has exceeded it. Attempts at introducing engine noise, gear changes etc are just gimmicks. I still want to see a lighter, nimble EV - maybe one day we will.
 
Onehp said:
For me, the car is a tool for driving, and the noises it makes are very important as a visceral and emotional feedback tool. But the sound isn't a thing by itself.
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but cant you see? you are being fooled, you are listening to FAKE noises, its like wearing a fake Rolex, you just know its wrong. You say the noises it makes are very important, obviously you settle for fakeness telling yourself its just like a 'proper engined car' ? EV's should be proud of being almost silent surely? want noise? get an engine. Want to drive electric? accept the real sound it makes and imagine you are in a 1960s Scalextric car... why go fake??
 
Old Boy said:
but cant you see? you are being fooled, you are listening to FAKE noises,
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Ok I think you made your point, you don't like it, at all. Got it. Fake fake yada yada.

Here is an old bugger that agreed with you fully, quite hilarious really and sure you'll enjoy it:

And then he tried it and, I truly never ever expected this from him, I had to collect my jaw from the floor, did a full 180 (full apology/explenation at 6:00 to 09:30) and he has a nice analogy for you too, quite hilarious too the whole thing :


But again, you don't have to like it, nobody is ACTUALLY telling you you can't drive your ICE anymore. Still have my GRY btw but,bit shockingly, haven't been much tempted to drive it. Well not in the dry at least, I'm not missing much. Hard words I know...

A few guys in the owner facebook group were just like you, and some still keep the odd Lambo, Ferrari, Porsche of GT-R on the side, at the same time expressing concern about not feeling so tempted anymore to take em out. Others still do and love both. You don't actually have to choose... I love driving my 5 N but still appreciate lots of ICE cars incl my GRY...
 
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Onehp said:
But again, you don't have to like it
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Yes but they're being conditioned

kaa-disney.webp
 
Bronson said:
An EV can try and match the sensation of driving an ICE, but there has never been one that has exceeded it. Attempts at introducing engine noise, gear changes etc are just gimmicks.
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I presume you mean succeeded.

With all respect, but have you actually tried a 5N in an environment conducive to driving fun? If so, I can respect that opinion ref gimmicks, not everyone feels the same. If not, plenty of very experienced drivers who have done so clearly disagree with that statement and then I suggest you put it to the test by actually trying one out.

It's like trying a new cuisine, but for drivers...


Bronson said:
I still want to see a lighter, nimble EV - maybe one day we will.
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Hear hear. And there have been a few already. Original roadster, i3s and some newcomers that get drowned in the raging storm of opinions and obsession with price, range and soulless 0-60...
 
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Onehp said:
I presume you mean succeeded.

With all respect, but have you actually tried a 5N in an environment conducive to driving fun? If so, I can respect that opinion ref gimmicks, not everyone feels the same. If not, plenty of very experienced drivers who have done so clearly disagree with that statement and then I suggest you put it to the test by actually trying one out.

It's like trying a new cuisine, but for drivers...



Hear hear. And there have been a few already. Original roadster, i3s and some newcomers that get drowned in the raging storm of opinions and obsession with price, range and soulless 0-60...
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I haven’t tried one, I should have said that generally speaking the majority of EVs have not been able to out do quite a number of ICE cars with just the pure sensation of driving. Perhaps this is fun to drive, the critique is aimed at the wider trend. Hyundai definitely deserve credit for making a step in the right direction.

Sports cars have usually set the trend for motoring progress over the last century. It has been an interesting aspect of the development of electric cars that we’re still really waiting for a genuine, mass market, out and out electric sports car. If we’ve had one, it’s probably been too expensive, too limited and no one has really learnt anything from it.

As I’ve said elsewhere, there is a place and a time for EVs, but they will never be the solution for everybody. I think if we’re just looking at this as buying a vehicle for fun, for pleasure, for a soul - I think EVs have a way to go. I don’t want to see/hear fake engine noises and gear changes.
 
For me the 5N is only the first of a kind, massively more interesting then other EVs to me and the first proper driver's car EV imho.
Bronson said:
... buying a vehicle for fun, for pleasure, for a soul
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EVs will never compete for that, as no fake sounds won't do, nor will fake... Like a Rolex, they will always be a place for old school cars.

However, when buying a vehicle for driving fun, for driving pleasure and for a driving soul, this car does a fine job.

Bronson said:
I haven’t tried one
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And frankly, if you don't give it a fair chance and try it out, properly, it's difficult to get it. Just reading about it or watching it on a screen, or interpolating from other EV experience doesn't really work. I feel like I'm trolling as I feel I keep repeating myself, but then I remember this is, in fact, a thread about the 5 N 😬 🫡
 
Sam said:
Yep, loads of Tesla based conversions around these days.

Not sure if these companies are buying from Tesla directly or using salvage.
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Bit of both. My father looked at an electric conversion for a Bristol and the prices are insane, even if you only opt for the drivetrain conversion.
 
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