What do horses have to do with this? Please explain why this upsets you, I really don't get it.
Another one: smoking kills, and still kills 8,5 million people per year globally. Is that also me on a high horse?
GR Yaris Opinion: Original exhaust and OPF
- Thread starter Onehp
- Start date
Another one: smoking kills, and still kills 8,5 million people per year globally. Is that also me on a high horse?
TheManWithTheStick
Totally Hooked
I'm not upset but I can see why people might be. Nobody likes being preached at, especially with such a "holier than thou" attitude. I'm sorry to hear about your friends but nothing you do here will change that.
You keep saying 10x which sounds big but 10x what exactly? 10x 0 is 0.
It's funny how all us poor individuals have to worry about our miniscule addition to this problem, which I do agree is a problem, while massive corporations are dumping crap in to the atmosphere left right and centre because doing something about it would eat in to their profits. It wouldn't surprise me if one single container ship bringing plastic trinkets from across the world will have more affect than a million of our quite efficient 1.6 engines with no GPF.
I'm not saying we should just go mad and start burning plastic in our gardens but come on man. Live and let live, each to their own etc.. Nobody is going to reinstall their GPF because you preached at them so what are you hoping to achieve? It seems like you just want an argument or to feel morally superior.
You keep saying 10x which sounds big but 10x what exactly? 10x 0 is 0.
It's funny how all us poor individuals have to worry about our miniscule addition to this problem, which I do agree is a problem, while massive corporations are dumping crap in to the atmosphere left right and centre because doing something about it would eat in to their profits. It wouldn't surprise me if one single container ship bringing plastic trinkets from across the world will have more affect than a million of our quite efficient 1.6 engines with no GPF.
I'm not saying we should just go mad and start burning plastic in our gardens but come on man. Live and let live, each to their own etc.. Nobody is going to reinstall their GPF because you preached at them so what are you hoping to achieve? It seems like you just want an argument or to feel morally superior.
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Look, I'm a vehicle engineer and driving enthusiast, and I have been following car emisison science since 1997 and worked with it at some point in my career too.
I'm just giving the information, the whole holier than you is on part of the receiver.
I could also turn it around, on what moral high ground do you think you have the right to (illegally) remove emission devices, and pretend nothing happens just because you don't see the victims and deny the link? Unlike smoking that hits the mostly the one doing it, this hits indiscriminately.
And no, it's not zero, far from. Euro6/7 allow 600 billion particles per driven kilometer, or 600 thousand per driven mm, to put it in units we can grasp. Without GPF that is roughly 10x that, or the same as 10 cars with GPF. On what basis do you think you have the right to make your car as bad as 10 others combined?
Now, I'm not actually taking this stance, it's just how actual preaching could look like.
Pointing the fingers at others doesn’t help. Shipping has through IMO 2020 Global Sulphur Cap and IMO tier I, II and III standards for NOx massively reduced their emissions globally. And new rules will be inforced the coming years also. China, the typical scapegoat, is also making large improvements in may areas.
Neither does playing the victim. Don't see what poor has to do with it, when you're spending money to make it worse....
So everyone has to do their part.
I don't expect people's to put it back, but maybe make an informed decision on the posisble consequences if considering removing it. Also see post 2 in this thread. Which I made 4,5 years ago, well before I became "holy" lol...
I'm just giving the information, the whole holier than you is on part of the receiver.
I could also turn it around, on what moral high ground do you think you have the right to (illegally) remove emission devices, and pretend nothing happens just because you don't see the victims and deny the link? Unlike smoking that hits the mostly the one doing it, this hits indiscriminately.
And no, it's not zero, far from. Euro6/7 allow 600 billion particles per driven kilometer, or 600 thousand per driven mm, to put it in units we can grasp. Without GPF that is roughly 10x that, or the same as 10 cars with GPF. On what basis do you think you have the right to make your car as bad as 10 others combined?
Now, I'm not actually taking this stance, it's just how actual preaching could look like.
Pointing the fingers at others doesn’t help. Shipping has through IMO 2020 Global Sulphur Cap and IMO tier I, II and III standards for NOx massively reduced their emissions globally. And new rules will be inforced the coming years also. China, the typical scapegoat, is also making large improvements in may areas.
Neither does playing the victim. Don't see what poor has to do with it, when you're spending money to make it worse....
So everyone has to do their part.
I don't expect people's to put it back, but maybe make an informed decision on the posisble consequences if considering removing it. Also see post 2 in this thread. Which I made 4,5 years ago, well before I became "holy" lol...
GRandemakina
Dedicated member
If the idea is to really make a difference(?)... how about choosing a better audience than us??
What about preaching to Russia, China, India... ev. US (would certainly be popular amoung Dems) and leave us well alone with our little 3-pot sewing machines??
What about preaching to Russia, China, India... ev. US (would certainly be popular amoung Dems) and leave us well alone with our little 3-pot sewing machines??
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Well this aspect of emissions affect yourself / locally
Just being emphatic, doesn't affect me.So I am actually leaving you alone on the part that does affect GHG and affects globally incl me.. Enthusiast cars get a pass in my book, and Toyota is stepping up their EV game finally for mundane transportation, which I have given them shit for before for being idle, elsewhere.
And it might seem counterintuitive to you, but arguiing, elsewhere, to keep car transportation clean/low impact and reducing fossil fuel use at large is only beneficial to the enthusiast hobby long term.
And actually I do argue to the big ones, esp US. Again, elsewhere.
Happy?
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tonic
Totally Hooked
- Aug 31, 2023
- 175
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@Onehp you shouldn’t be surprised by the resistance you're getting. It's like going to a rock festival and using the stage to preach about how bad excessive alcohol use is.
I'm not even getting into the hypocrisy, but how do the JB4 adjusted G16E signals compare to removing the OPF?
I'm not even getting into the hypocrisy, but how do the JB4 adjusted G16E signals compare to removing the OPF?
@Onehp you shouldn’t be surprised by the resistance you're getting. It's like going to a rock festival and using the stage to preach about how bad excessive alcohol use is.
I'm not even getting into the hypocrisy, but how do the JB4 adjusted G16E signals compare to removing the OPF?
Not really, quite a few have a more mature and nuanced relationship to the motor car and the driver hobby, but sure enough this time over I triggered a few.
Again, just giving the information. I also started the massive ECUTEK thread. Is it posisble I have a well reasoned position on this, weighing pro and cons, short and long term?
And to answer your question, the JB4 changes the boost but with hardware improvements (HJS) hardly changes emissions, maybe even improves them at WOT (outside test regime) as running bit less rich by choice for more power. Removing OPF is ballpark 10x worse. Happy to discuss more, as this is 'my' thread.
TheManWithTheStick
Totally Hooked
Why sad?
We made a hobby of a transportation system, what you expect?
There has always been a tension between existing cars and new cars. Every era or cars still has their fans and that's not going away, not for the GRY either, which is set to become a classic.
As for new cars, mostly good news recently
- 2035 EU goal has been revised to 90% reduction, making room for combustion enthusiast cars (way less than 10%) to remain posisble
- Euro7 rules have been made a lot more lenient and postponed, again opening up for a continued enthusiast focus for some cars
- Toyota is hinting at a lot of enthusiast models and getting their EV act together, these go hand in hand imho, one allows the other.
Let's move on, it's getting silly.
We made a hobby of a transportation system, what you expect?
There has always been a tension between existing cars and new cars. Every era or cars still has their fans and that's not going away, not for the GRY either, which is set to become a classic.
As for new cars, mostly good news recently
- 2035 EU goal has been revised to 90% reduction, making room for combustion enthusiast cars (way less than 10%) to remain posisble
- Euro7 rules have been made a lot more lenient and postponed, again opening up for a continued enthusiast focus for some cars
- Toyota is hinting at a lot of enthusiast models and getting their EV act together, these go hand in hand imho, one allows the other.
Let's move on, it's getting silly.
Michael Knight
Totally Hooked
Off topic but I'm very interested in seeing in practice how Toyota has resolved heat management in that mid mounted MR2 etc. utilizing the 4cyl-super engine producing 400hp. Even with GR the heat is enemy no.1 and it has better positioning for radiators. of course, there is same potential with mid-engined car but the implementation curve is likely tad steeper.
TheManWithTheStick
Totally Hooked
Yes it is getting silly, I'm glad you've noticed.
I'm not sad. It's sad that you're still banging on about this, here of all places.
I expect to come here to see and discuss what others are doing with their GR cars. Not be lectured about the environment. You have no idea what any of us do for the environment, any of us could be even more 'eco' than you are but you'd never know, yet you still feel the need to preach at people. Its a bit bizarre really.
For me this is not about any tension between new and existing cars. My main car is a PHEV which does the vast majority of my yearly mileage and mostly on electric, but nobody knows this because I've no reason to mention it plus nobody here will care.
This is the last I'll say on the matter. I didn't even want to post this but you are jumping to some wild assumptions and just won't let it go. You aren't making friends or influencing people here I'm afraid to say. Any more pointless facts or bullet points you post on this will get no response from me.
I'm not sad. It's sad that you're still banging on about this, here of all places.
I expect to come here to see and discuss what others are doing with their GR cars. Not be lectured about the environment. You have no idea what any of us do for the environment, any of us could be even more 'eco' than you are but you'd never know, yet you still feel the need to preach at people. Its a bit bizarre really.
For me this is not about any tension between new and existing cars. My main car is a PHEV which does the vast majority of my yearly mileage and mostly on electric, but nobody knows this because I've no reason to mention it plus nobody here will care.
This is the last I'll say on the matter. I didn't even want to post this but you are jumping to some wild assumptions and just won't let it go. You aren't making friends or influencing people here I'm afraid to say. Any more pointless facts or bullet points you post on this will get no response from me.
Now, maybe we can discuss the massive excess deaths and cancers deliberately caused by the Covid jabs!
