GR86 Engine Failure

Are you concerned about the GR86 engine failure stories emerging?

  • 1. Not concerned - if it breaks Toyota will fix it

    Votes: 48 39.3%

  • 2. Slightly concerned - but not losing any sleep over it

    Votes: 53 43.4%

  • 3. I’m getting worried - I want to use my car on track

    Votes: 13 10.7%

  • 4. I’m very worried - I’d planned a lot of mods and lots of track use

    Votes: 2 1.6%

  • 5. I’m that worried I’m cancelling - and off to buy something else

    Votes: 6 4.9%
  • Total voters
    122
Kosh said:
The point is, that there is no issue.
At least not yet.
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Well, based on an objective and rational analysis of all the video and other evidence which has been carefully collated on this thread, perhaps we can at least agree that there are legitimate questions to be asked about the application of the RTV sealant used by Subaru during the manufacture of the company's FA24D engines.

However, beyond that, I respectfully suggest that we agree to differ and let the other members of this forum reach their own judgments on the basis of all the available evidence...
 
My dealer called me today to follow up on my question about the RTV issue many months ago (when the issue first appeared on forums and the internet was on fire).

Even though Toyota EU is silent about it they want to borescope the oilpan and if necessary drop it and re-seal it in warranty. My GR86 has RTV on the dipstick by the way. I didn't like the sales guy who "sold" me the car and his lack of interest and communication, but my opinion about the dealership changed. The follow-up and the fact they want to investigate this as a service to their customers regardless of Toyota EU's silence is reassuring. I did not expect this.
 
To fit that shopping basket sized strainer you have to remove the sump, which means removing the gasket and reapplying it.... surely you would have then eliminated the whole reason of fitting it in the first place?
 
ZN8 said:
To fit that shopping basket sized strainer you have to remove the sump, which means removing the gasket and reapplying it.... surely you would have then eliminated the whole reason of fitting it in the first place?
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No, the silicon also comes from the heads.

But yes, sealing the sump manually overhead will not be better, than done by a robot...
 
Kosh said:
No, the silicon also comes from the heads.

But yes, sealing the sump manually overhead will not be better, than done by a robot...
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Nothing on the head uses sealant, only gaskets. There was mention of the timing chain cover causing it but that was disproven, the main culprit is the sump gasket.

A robot is only as good as the human programming it, you would apply the sealant by hand on the sump when its on a bench, not the bottom of the block over your head, I don't know why you would overcomplicate it.
 
ZN8 said:
Nothing on the head uses sealant, only gaskets. There was mention of the timing chain cover causing it but that was disproven, the main culprit is the sump gasket.

A robot is only as good as the human programming it, you would apply the sealant by hand on the sump when its on a bench, not the bottom of the block over your head, I don't know why you would overcomplicate it.
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There is plenty of silicon popping out the sides of the top of my engine



If its on the outside its on the inside too...
 
Kiwi Greg said:
There is plenty of silicon popping out the sides of the top of my engine



If its on the outside its on the inside too...
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Yeah that'll be your timing chain cover, not the cylinder head.


EDIT: I think I might be wrong RE head using gaskets, however I think the strainer is pointless, anything big will stay up in the head, anything small enough to get from the head back to the sump will go through it anyway.
 
ZN8 said:
Yeah that'll be your timing chain cover, not the cylinder head.


EDIT: I think I might be wrong RE head using gaskets, however I think the strainer is pointless, anything big will stay up in the head, anything small enough to get from the head back to the sump will go through it anyway.
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If i remeber correctly "our" subaru guy said, that the cant use traditional gaskets, becase of the alminum and change in length, when the block gets warmer.

Thats why, they use silicone...
 
If I did get a problem would look at rebuilding the engine myself that way could add aftermarket cams forged pistons or maybe a stroker kit if available by then. Always happier with a car I can fix myself
 
This video came up on my recommended list this morning, I thought it might be of interest here. Someone has done a fairly in depth test of both a new BRZ/GR86 with the FA24 and also a first gen BRZ with the FA20 to log oil pressure drops during track use. The tl;dw is basically that they think that the issues encountered are down to flaws in engine design rather than excess RTV (the GR86 with the cleaned sump/pickup still had the same pressure drops). Basically, don't turn right over crests and you should be fine :p

Not being an engineer I won't comment too much, but it's worth a watch especially if you track your GR86.

 
Conscript said:
This video came up on my recommended list this morning, I thought it might be of interest here. Someone has done a fairly in depth test of both a new BRZ/GR86 with the FA24 and also a first gen BRZ with the FA20 to log oil pressure drops during track use. The tl;dw is basically that they think that the issues encountered are down to flaws in engine design rather than excess RTV (the GR86 with the cleaned sump/pickup still had the same pressure drops). Basically, don't turn right over crests and you should be fine :p

Not being an engineer I won't comment too much, but it's worth a watch especially if you track your GR86.

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I watched it last night. I am slightly concerned.
I plan on doing 1 or 2 track days a year and driving with care while making progress in the public roads and that includes roundabouts

Killerb is working on a baffle and an oil pan, there a few baffles out too and the GR86 cup caps in the USA and Japan use different baffles to oem.
 
Grblue86 said:
I watched it last night. I am slightly concerned.
I plan on doing 1 or 2 track days a year and driving with care while making progress in the public roads and that includes roundabouts

Killerb is working on a baffle and an oil pan, there a few baffles out too and the GR86 cup caps in the USA and Japan use different baffles to oem.
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Agreed, there is opportunity to see higher lateral G’s on the road. I used the fact my GT has lasted 65k and 7 years to convince myself the GR should be reliable enough, however as this seems new to the FA24 that comfort has been removed.

I am also not thrilled Toyota moved to a manufacturer warranty of 3 years and then “service activated warranty” for another 7. The T&Cs say they can change the warranty terms in any way at any time. I’m no legal expert but I’m not convinced the 10yrs is guaranteed (although reputation damage if they backtracked). Of course they can change the service pricing to whatever they want.

I read in the comments on the video that one cup team had 3 engine failures in a short space of time, so not sure they’ve solved it. An aftermarket baffle would invalidate your warranty, so unfortunately not a viable solution for those just wanting to enjoy their cars on the road and keep the warranty.

I’m back on the fence about whether to proceed with my order 🤔
 
KobayashiMaru86 said:
Way I see it, it's still under warranty for 3 years. If you aren't happy after that then decide to keep and adapt or move on. Life's too short to drive boring cars.
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The choice isn’t between this and a Prius. My preference is not to switch cars that often; that is usually a fast track to losing lots of money. It is to be seen if these will be different over the longer term. I’m just disappointed as this purchase was meant to see me through to being forced into an EV, but there are headwinds to that plan.
 
According to the comments on that video, someone with contacts at Toyota is sending it to them. Hopefully it gets passed of the right Toyota engineers.
 
Would be good to see what Japanese tuners are doing about it or even if it's shown up there. Strange it's right turns only, which given we have roundabouts here is a concern. But again, it's under warranty. I'm concerned but surely with boxers being used elsewhere for years, has this come up anywhere else before?
 
Grblue86 said:
I watched it last night. I am slightly concerned.
I plan on doing 1 or 2 track days a year and driving with care while making progress in the public roads and that includes roundabouts

Killerb is working on a baffle and an oil pan, there a few baffles out too and the GR86 cup caps in the USA and Japan use different baffles to oem.
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Hmmm me too, I was planning on taking mine on track next month. Thats some pretty compelling data.

KobayashiMaru86 said:
Way I see it, it's still under warranty for 3 years. If you aren't happy after that then decide to keep and adapt or move on. Life's too short to drive boring cars.
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You could go say oh well its got warranty but given how things have been, how long would you want to be without your car for? 3 months, maybe 6? It sure as hell won't be a seamless ride, then there is the likelihood of encountering issues, whether its them scuffing your paintwork, poor workmanship, its certainly not going to be factory levels of fit and finish, no thanks I'd rather not have anyone touch it if they don't need to.
 
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