GR Yaris (Gen 2) Automatic gearbox issue: paddles do not upshift under acceleration?

[Norbi]

Hey y’all, besides having the issue of the constant grin on my face after 1.200km and the first oil change by now, there is one really weird thing: the paddles do not work as an override in upshifting under decent acceleration. Here’s the situation: overtaking somebody, say, in 3rd gear, accel from 80 to, say 120/130/140. Especially during the break-in period, during that overtake I liked to manually override the RPMs to avoid going into yellow or even red. But the paddle shifters just won’t do that. The dashboard in the middle even shows that I WANT/have set the higher gears (4/5/6, there’s that little number counting up over the truly selected gear), but the car stays in 3rd, going all the way into yellow and even briefly red(!), before finally making the shift to 4 and maybe 5, when I get off the throttle quite a bit. Not ideal to have to do that during an overtake, of course. Doesn’t matter whether it’s in normal or sport mode, same in track/normal/gravel.

Am I missing something? The car will shift gear immediately in the same situation if it’s in manual mode. But in “D”, it’s “confused”. It will also shift DOWN immediately. But not up. There’s nothing in the manual, afaik. Has anybody had the same phenomenon?

 

[Ecsrobin]

Hey y’all, besides having the issue of the constant grin on my face after 1.200km and the first oil change by now, there is one really weird thing: the paddles do not work as an override in upshifting under decent acceleration. Here’s the situation: overtaking somebody, say, in 3rd gear, accel from 80 to, say 120/130/140. Especially during the break-in period, during that overtake I liked to manually override the RPMs to avoid going into yellow or even red. But the paddle shifters just won’t do that. The dashboard in the middle even shows that I WANT/have set the higher gears (4/5/6, there’s that little number counting up over the truly selected gear), but the car stays in 3rd, going all the way into yellow and even briefly red(!), before finally making the shift to 4 and maybe 5, when I get off the throttle quite a bit. Not ideal to have to do that during an overtake, of course. Doesn’t matter whether it’s in normal or sport mode, same in track/normal/gravel.

Am I missing something? The car will shift gear immediately in the same situation if it’s in manual mode. But in “D”, it’s “confused”. It will also shift DOWN immediately. But not up. There’s nothing in the manual, afaik. Has anybody had the same phenomenon?

Just let it do its thing is my advice. Yes it happens to me but if I want to change gears I put it in manual. At first I saw it as a problem but then realised the car probably knows better than me.

 

[Fred]

In auto mode you cannot override the shifting (with the paddles).
I manual mode it does what you want, like Ecsrobin wrote.

 

[sixtentouge]

Just let it do its thing is my advice. Yes it happens to me but if I want to change gears I put it in manual. At first I saw it as a problem but then realised the car probably knows better than me.

Every test I've seen here in Japan, gymkhana, dirt trial track, circuit, etc., the car is quicker when left to its own devices vs. the driver shifting it. But that's not much fun

 

[JFO]

In auto mode you cannot override the shifting (with the paddles).
I manual mode it does what you want, like Ecsrobin wrote.

It's not quite right, it also changes in D, but there are other criteria that make it not change systematically.

 

[BlueGoose]

I sort of wish in Auto mine shifted more like yours.

Mine in Auto mode wants to get to 8th as fast as possible. It goes round a roundabout in 3/4th. I've tried all the setting normal sport etc it seems to make no difference on mine.

If I drive in manual after it's warmed up then it's fine. I basically don't do auto as the box is really really bad.

 

[Ecsrobin]

I sort of wish in Auto mine shifted more like yours.

Mine in Auto mode wants to get to 8th as fast as possible. It goes round a roundabout in 3/4th. I've tried all the setting normal sport etc it seems to make no difference on mine.

If I drive in manual after it's warmed up then it's fine. I basically don't do auto as the box is really really bad.

It’s adaptive so if you’re driving slow then it will want to keep a higher gear there’s nothing wrong with being on a roundabout in 3rd or 4th it’s not like the car will be juddering away like if you were in a manual as it will just shift down if it needs to.

 

[Norbi]

Can we please stick with the topic: a paddle-shift override (only upshift!) does not work.

I’ve tested many scenarios, but no answer here was really explanatory. Another example: straight highway in Germany, no incline, cruise control on 180, and car stays in 7th, not 8th (although rpm in 8th is def not too low).
Of course I know I can upshift when I switch to manual mode, but then cruise control deactivates… Why on earth did they program it this way?

My only explanation would be the intent to protect the turbo from lugging, because higher rpms reduce the necessary boost to cruise at 180 by a few percentage points?

 

[Ecsrobin]

Can we please stick with the topic: a paddle-shift override (only upshift!) does not work.

I’ve tested many scenarios, but no answer here was really explanatory. Another example: straight highway in Germany, no incline, cruise control on 180, and car stays in 7th, not 8th (although rpm in 8th is def not too low).
Of course I know I can upshift when I switch to manual mode, but then cruise control deactivates… Why on earth did they program it this way?

My only explanation would be the intent to protect the turbo from lugging, because higher rpms reduce the necessary boost to cruise at 180 by a few percentage points?

I think the first reply to you was the answer.

The car is measuring lots of parameters and believes that 7th is the most suitable gear. I’ve driven the same motorway at home and some days it’s holds 7th and some times 8th. It doesn’t change how the car drives but something in the programming believes the gear to be the correct one.

 

[area_educator]

Can we please stick with the topic: a paddle-shift override (only upshift!) does not work.

I’ve tested many scenarios, but no answer here was really explanatory.

On pretty much any reasonably modern automatic that offers a manual mode, if you try to shift it while in auto mode you're really saying to the car "I'd like to do this. How do you feel about that?" I mean, that's generally the case for manual mode as well, but the threshold for what it agrees to moves from "Is this a good idea?" toward "Will it break something?"

Why doesn't it let you upshift on acceleration? Because your right foot is telling the car one thing and your right hand is telling it another (a perhaps-better solution might be for the car to switch to manual mode in such an instance). That you're trying to keep the RPMs down for the break-in period is a pretty good manual-mode use-case.

Why is it cruising at 180 km/hr in 7th instead of 8th when 8th isn't lugging? Could be gas mileage goals or emissions goals.

 

[Armijs]

Can we please stick with the topic: a paddle-shift override (only upshift!) does not work.

I’ve tested many scenarios, but no answer here was really explanatory. Another example: straight highway in Germany, no incline, cruise control on 180, and car stays in 7th, not 8th (although rpm in 8th is def not too low).
Of course I know I can upshift when I switch to manual mode, but then cruise control deactivates… Why on earth did they program it this way?

My only explanation would be the intent to protect the turbo from lugging, because higher rpms reduce the necessary boost to cruise at 180 by a few percentage points?

To remedy this i put it up slightly and then drop a few kmh on cruise then it switches to 8
Another thing if you are on cruise on 180 kmh/h, even if it is a straight, not only uphill, the wind resistance is big enough for the car to warrant to keep it in 7th, if you will go downhill, the car will switch to 8th gear without your help, i tested this myself in Poland.

 

[Armijs]

I sort of wish in Auto mine shifted more like yours.

Mine in Auto mode wants to get to 8th as fast as possible. It goes round a roundabout in 3/4th. I've tried all the setting normal sport etc it seems to make no difference on mine.

If I drive in manual after it's warmed up then it's fine. I basically don't do auto as the box is really really bad.

I dont agree, i work in the auto repair industry, and it seems you have not driven a car with a trully awfull automatic, CVT without the E at the end or god forbid a robot that switches basiacally a manual for you. This gearbox is excellent for what it is. My car for example keeps the gears much lower even in town and RPM higher in sports mode. So i dont share your gripes. In normal or eco it is fine to drive around town, really rarely it does not change gears up quick enough when in town where it slightly drops to like 1500 rpm or so, but that is so seldom that i dont even mind. All depends on how you handle the accelerator pedal.

I have basically driven it in manual mode 3 times maybe for a few mins ? The auto in my opinion is that good, even when doing donuts and drifting around parking lots in lots of snow, sport mode, gravel or track mode, master mode on, on the switch, and it keeps the gears low and rpms high, i have not felt the need to change gears myself, and i have mostly driven manuals my whole life, i have been at the wheel for 18 years now. Its that good, again, for me .

 

[Norbi]

On pretty much any reasonably modern automatic …

May I respectfully disagree: PDKs don’t do that, BMWs (ZF 8-speed) either. Shift paddles on both brands do override the D mode.

Why is it cruising at 180 km/hr in 7th instead of 8th when 8th isn't lugging? Could be gas mileage goals or emissions goals.

Better gas mileage/emissions (at that speed) through higher rpms? Doubt it.

 

[Norbi]

Alright, in the German forum I was just directed to this video, which shows the exact topic at min 11:55 and 13:13:


Just in case other AT owners are ever wondering here . To me, that looks like a software bug. No, not a feature!

 

[Ecsrobin]

Alright, in the German forum I was just directed to this video, which shows the exact topic at min 11:55 and 13:13:


Just in case other AT owners are ever wondering here . To me, that looks like a software bug. No, not a feature!

Unless you can see the parameters the software is looking for you will never know. Don’t think you can call it a bug.

 

[Norbi]

Finally had a chance to talk to the chief engineering dude of North-East Italy today (he understood the issue well, as he’s been working for Porsche before, where that’s not an issue)

Final verdict: In Toyota-world, this is a feature, not a bug.
Period.
Case closed!
Basta.


(He was actually very nice…)

 

[Ecsrobin]

Just let it do its thing is my advice. Yes it happens to me but if I want to change gears I put it in manual. At first I saw it as a problem but then realised the car probably knows better than me.

 

[Sterbo]

Hi guys, today I picked up my mk2 dat… can you clear up a doubt for me? Is it normal that even being delicate with the accelerator, the gears are changed at about 2300-2400 rpm and if you press just 1mm more the accelerator easily changes gear at 3000 rpm? I'm used to vw that only in sport change so high with little accelerator

 

[SckSqzBngBlo]

It will probably adapt to your driving style fairly quickly, just keep driving it

 

[Sterbo]

It will probably adapt to your driving style fairly quickly, just keep driving it

how does it behave to you? I see from many videos that it never shifts up if the revs could drop below 2000... it seems like they want to keep the engine happy... even if they are stable at 2000 rpm at 55km/h, it maintains the gear, it does not shift up to the next gear…

I was wondering if you also get a gear change above 2000 rpm and not at 2000 rpm or just before